{"id":356102,"date":"2024-12-20T15:58:54","date_gmt":"2024-12-20T14:58:54","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/climatescience.press\/?p=356102"},"modified":"2024-12-20T15:58:57","modified_gmt":"2024-12-20T14:58:57","slug":"blockbuster-honesty-expert-modeler-admits-they-cant-predict-extreme-events-el-nino-tipping-points-rain-or-river-flows","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/climatescience.press\/?p=356102","title":{"rendered":"Blockbuster honesty: Expert modeler admits they can\u2019t predict extreme events, El Nino, tipping points, rain or river flows"},"content":{"rendered":"\n<figure class=\"wp-block-image size-large\"><img data-recalc-dims=\"1\" loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" width=\"723\" height=\"482\" data-attachment-id=\"356122\" data-permalink=\"https:\/\/climatescience.press\/?attachment_id=356122\" data-orig-file=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/12\/0mike-newbry-DwtX9mMHBJ0-unsplash-scaled-1.jpg?fit=2560%2C1707&amp;ssl=1\" data-orig-size=\"2560,1707\" data-comments-opened=\"1\" data-image-meta=\"{&quot;aperture&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;credit&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;camera&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;caption&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;created_timestamp&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;copyright&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;focal_length&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;iso&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;shutter_speed&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;title&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;orientation&quot;:&quot;0&quot;}\" data-image-title=\"0mike-newbry-DwtX9mMHBJ0-unsplash-scaled\" data-image-description=\"\" data-image-caption=\"\" data-large-file=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/12\/0mike-newbry-DwtX9mMHBJ0-unsplash-scaled-1.jpg?fit=723%2C482&amp;ssl=1\" src=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/12\/0mike-newbry-DwtX9mMHBJ0-unsplash-scaled-1.jpg?resize=723%2C482&#038;ssl=1\" alt=\"\" class=\"wp-image-356122\" srcset=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/12\/0mike-newbry-DwtX9mMHBJ0-unsplash-scaled-1.jpg?resize=1024%2C683&amp;ssl=1 1024w, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/12\/0mike-newbry-DwtX9mMHBJ0-unsplash-scaled-1.jpg?resize=300%2C200&amp;ssl=1 300w, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/12\/0mike-newbry-DwtX9mMHBJ0-unsplash-scaled-1.jpg?resize=768%2C512&amp;ssl=1 768w, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/12\/0mike-newbry-DwtX9mMHBJ0-unsplash-scaled-1.jpg?resize=1536%2C1024&amp;ssl=1 1536w, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/12\/0mike-newbry-DwtX9mMHBJ0-unsplash-scaled-1.jpg?resize=2048%2C1366&amp;ssl=1 2048w, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/12\/0mike-newbry-DwtX9mMHBJ0-unsplash-scaled-1.jpg?resize=1200%2C800&amp;ssl=1 1200w, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/12\/0mike-newbry-DwtX9mMHBJ0-unsplash-scaled-1.jpg?w=1446&amp;ssl=1 1446w, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/12\/0mike-newbry-DwtX9mMHBJ0-unsplash-scaled-1.jpg?w=2169&amp;ssl=1 2169w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 723px) 100vw, 723px\" \/><\/figure>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">From <a href=\"https:\/\/joannenova.com.au\/2024\/12\/blockbuster-honesty-climate-models-cant-predict-extreme-events-sea-level-rise-tipping-points-or-river-flows\/\">JoNova<\/a><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><a href=\"https:\/\/joannenova.com.au\/2024\/12\/blockbuster-honesty-climate-models-cant-predict-extreme-events-sea-level-rise-tipping-points-or-river-flows\/\"><strong>By Jo Nova<\/strong><\/a><\/p>\n\n\n\n<figure class=\"wp-block-image size-full is-resized\"><img data-recalc-dims=\"1\" loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" width=\"640\" height=\"427\" data-attachment-id=\"356105\" data-permalink=\"https:\/\/climatescience.press\/?attachment_id=356105\" data-orig-file=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/12\/image-376.png?fit=640%2C427&amp;ssl=1\" data-orig-size=\"640,427\" data-comments-opened=\"1\" data-image-meta=\"{&quot;aperture&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;credit&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;camera&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;caption&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;created_timestamp&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;copyright&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;focal_length&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;iso&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;shutter_speed&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;title&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;orientation&quot;:&quot;0&quot;}\" data-image-title=\"image\" data-image-description=\"\" data-image-caption=\"\" data-large-file=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/12\/image-376.png?fit=640%2C427&amp;ssl=1\" src=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/12\/image-376.png?resize=640%2C427&#038;ssl=1\" alt=\"\" class=\"wp-image-356105\" style=\"width:760px;height:auto\" srcset=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/12\/image-376.png?w=640&amp;ssl=1 640w, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/12\/image-376.png?resize=300%2C200&amp;ssl=1 300w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 640px) 100vw, 640px\" \/><\/figure>\n\n\n\n<h3 class=\"wp-block-heading\">The science is settled, except when they need more money<\/h3>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Australia\u2019s leading climate modeler wants a big new Climate Agency, and to make the case he admits the current models really can\u2019t predict if rivers will rise or fall, if Antarctica will get bigger or smaller, if sea levels will rise much, or if El Ninos or La Nina will be more common or if the floods of Lismore will occur more often.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">To give us some idea of how bad the current models are, he\u2019s recommending we shift from models with 100 kilometer blocks to high resolution models with 1 km cells. These new models will be at least 10,000 times bigger than current ones, and if they increase the vertical slices, they could easily be one hundred thousand or even a million times bigger.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">And if they get this super model, they\u2019ll need 10,000 to one million times the energy. But now that we\u2019ve wrecked the grid, good luck running those monster data centers off sunlight and breezes.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Full credit to Tony Thomas for digging through pages of turgid text and webinars to uncover the truth.<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n<div class=\"wp-block-image\">\n<figure class=\"aligncenter size-full\"><img data-recalc-dims=\"1\" loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" width=\"433\" height=\"558\" data-attachment-id=\"356109\" data-permalink=\"https:\/\/climatescience.press\/?attachment_id=356109\" data-orig-file=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/12\/image-378.png?fit=433%2C558&amp;ssl=1\" data-orig-size=\"433,558\" data-comments-opened=\"1\" data-image-meta=\"{&quot;aperture&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;credit&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;camera&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;caption&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;created_timestamp&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;copyright&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;focal_length&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;iso&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;shutter_speed&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;title&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;orientation&quot;:&quot;0&quot;}\" data-image-title=\"image\" data-image-description=\"\" data-image-caption=\"\" data-large-file=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/12\/image-378.png?fit=433%2C558&amp;ssl=1\" src=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/12\/image-378.png?resize=433%2C558&#038;ssl=1\" alt=\"\" class=\"wp-image-356109\" srcset=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/12\/image-378.png?w=433&amp;ssl=1 433w, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/12\/image-378.png?resize=233%2C300&amp;ssl=1 233w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 433px) 100vw, 433px\" \/><figcaption class=\"wp-element-caption\">Andy Pitman, November 2024<\/figcaption><\/figure>\n<\/div>\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Oh Boy it\u2019s an eye-popping list.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">In the past, Pitman has admitted climate change doesn\u2019t&nbsp;<a href=\"https:\/\/joannenova.com.au\/2019\/08\/prof-andy-pitman-admits-droughts-are-not-worse-and-not-linked-to-climate-change\/\">necessarily cause more droughts<\/a>. He\u2019s also said he wouldn\u2019t bet his&nbsp;<a href=\"https:\/\/joannenova.com.au\/2022\/09\/climate-models-not-good-enough-to-invest-my-superannuation-in-says-modeler-prof-andy-pitman\/\">superannuation (pension fund) on the climate models<\/a>. This time Pitman admits the models are low resolution, have a lot of \u201ccritical gaps\u201d, don\u2019t resolve the oceans or clouds well, and that using the best CMIP6 models (the same ones the expert UN has beaten us over the head with) may risk \u201c<strong>fundamentally wrong projections<\/strong>&nbsp;<strong>of future climate and its variability.<\/strong>\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Shouldn\u2019t every Australian know this? I mean we\u2019re spending half a trillion dollars to solve \u201cclimate change\u201d but the models might be&nbsp;<em>fundamentally<\/em>&nbsp;wrong?&nbsp; Doesn\u2019t that matter. The seas might not swamp us, the rivers might keep flowing. Antarctica might not melt?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Where was Andy Pitman when Australia was wrecking its grid, destroying jobs and our lifestyles? Where were any of our climate academics when leaders of our political parties were telling us that every drought, fire and storm was caused by climate change and would only get worse?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>The Ivory Tower elitists sat silently by when the government forces bricklayers, farmers and children to solve a climate problem that might be just a modeling error?<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">And now they want more money \u2014 and I would say we desperately need models that work, but what\u2019s the point, if we can\u2019t trust the modelers to be absolutely, scrupulously honest with us?<\/p>\n\n\n<div class=\"wp-block-image\">\n<figure class=\"aligncenter size-full\"><img data-recalc-dims=\"1\" loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" width=\"256\" height=\"99\" data-attachment-id=\"356110\" data-permalink=\"https:\/\/climatescience.press\/?attachment_id=356110\" data-orig-file=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/12\/image-379.png?fit=256%2C99&amp;ssl=1\" data-orig-size=\"256,99\" data-comments-opened=\"1\" data-image-meta=\"{&quot;aperture&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;credit&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;camera&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;caption&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;created_timestamp&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;copyright&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;focal_length&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;iso&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;shutter_speed&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;title&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;orientation&quot;:&quot;0&quot;}\" data-image-title=\"image\" data-image-description=\"\" data-image-caption=\"\" data-large-file=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/12\/image-379.png?fit=256%2C99&amp;ssl=1\" src=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/12\/image-379.png?resize=256%2C99&#038;ssl=1\" alt=\"\" class=\"wp-image-356110\"\/><\/figure>\n<\/div>\n\n\n<h3 class=\"wp-block-heading\"><a href=\"https:\/\/quadrant.org.au\/news-opinions\/doomed-planet\/climate-science-you-can-believe\/\">Climate Science You Can Believe<\/a><\/h3>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">By Tony Thomas,&nbsp;<em>Quadrant<\/em><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Pitman even concedes that current climate models can\u2019t predict whether natural disasters will become more or less common in the warming era. Remember his words when you next hear the ABC or Climate Council claiming that such-and-such storms and floods are \u201cclimate-fuelled\u201d.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Using current CMIP models, or indeed the regional models that rely on them, therefore<strong>&nbsp;risks fundamentally wrong projections<\/strong>&nbsp;of future climate and its variability. \u2014 P17 of \u201c<a href=\"https:\/\/www.science.org.au\/files\/userfiles\/support\/reports-and-plans\/2024\/decadal-plan-earth-system-science-2024-33.pdf\">The Decadal Plan<\/a>\u201c<\/p>\n\n\n\n<h4 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Now they tell us? Modelers don\u2019t know if we\u2019ll get more wind droughts or cloudy days?<\/h4>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Right after we built 12,000 megawatts of weather dependent generators, we find out that the modelers have no idea whether we will get more long spells of cloudy windless days which cripple our grid. This new vulnerability is buried under the label&nbsp;<em>\u201cHigh impact weather events\u201d<\/em>. As if windless nights belong in the same category as storms and floods.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">It\u2019s hidden in one of the Five Key Questions of National Significance:<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">5. Where will changes in high impact weather events support and\/or undermine net zero ambition and where can associated risks be managed effectively?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Like the rest of the document the language is obtuse, convoluted, and speaks with a forked tongue. They don\u2019t want to come out and just say Australia badly needs models a million times bigger so we can predict the climate.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<h4 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Tony Thomas sums it up:<\/h4>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">He [Pitman et al] also admits that he and fellow climate alarmists have no idea:<\/p>\n\n\n\n<ul class=\"wp-block-list\">\n<li>\n<ul class=\"wp-block-list\">\n<li>\n<ul class=\"wp-block-list\">\n<li>\n<ul class=\"wp-block-list\">\n<li>\n<ul class=\"wp-block-list\">\n<li>when and where so-called \u201ctipping points\u201d might arise (wow, so honest!)<\/li>\n\n\n\n<li>whether climate change will increase or decrease the Murray Darling water flows<\/li>\n\n\n\n<li>whether an increase in CO2 will cause more or less rain for a given location<\/li>\n\n\n\n<li>how climate change will impact cities and urban landscapes (Andy, stop upsetting the Melbourne and Sydney city councils\u2019 climate crusaders)<\/li>\n\n\n\n<li>how wind droughts and heavy clouding might undermine renewables and net-zero targeting (via week-long blackouts).<\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<\/li>\n<\/ul>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">In a repudiation of the \u201csettled science\u201d notion the climate crowd has pushed for 25 years, Pitman now acknowledges that despite decades of study, the catastrophists still have no idea if Australia will see more El Nino, rather than La Nina, climate events, or even whether more vegetation will reduce or increase greenhouse emissions (so much for tree plantings offsetting emissions). \u201cThese are not easily solvable but offer profoundly different futures for Australia,\u201d he admits (p13). Odd that we are to invest trillions in net zero when we have no idea what\u2019s what.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<h3 class=\"wp-block-heading\">We need models thousands of times better!<\/h3>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Pitman lays out many shortcomings of current \u201cexpert\u201d climate models because he\u2019d really like a much finer resolution model of just 1km2.<\/p>\n\n\n<div class=\"wp-block-image\">\n<figure class=\"aligncenter size-full\"><img data-recalc-dims=\"1\" loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" width=\"400\" height=\"561\" data-attachment-id=\"356113\" data-permalink=\"https:\/\/climatescience.press\/?attachment_id=356113\" data-orig-file=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/12\/image-381.png?fit=400%2C561&amp;ssl=1\" data-orig-size=\"400,561\" data-comments-opened=\"1\" data-image-meta=\"{&quot;aperture&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;credit&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;camera&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;caption&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;created_timestamp&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;copyright&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;focal_length&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;iso&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;shutter_speed&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;title&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;orientation&quot;:&quot;0&quot;}\" data-image-title=\"image\" data-image-description=\"\" data-image-caption=\"\" data-large-file=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/12\/image-381.png?fit=400%2C561&amp;ssl=1\" src=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/12\/image-381.png?resize=400%2C561&#038;ssl=1\" alt=\"\" class=\"wp-image-356113\" srcset=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/12\/image-381.png?w=400&amp;ssl=1 400w, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/12\/image-381.png?resize=214%2C300&amp;ssl=1 214w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 400px) 100vw, 400px\" \/><\/figure>\n<\/div>\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Ocean processes operate across many scales, and eddies in the Southern Ocean transfer considerable heat and nutrients14. These eddies are also crucial to the uptake, transport and storage of carbon15. Operating at scales of order 10 km, they are too fine to be resolved in ocean models used for climate projections.&nbsp;<strong>This means the role that&nbsp;<\/strong><strong>oceans play in influencing climate are poorly resolve<\/strong>d. \u2013 p17<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>As a result of their poor resolution, current climate models do not faithfully represent critical weather systems,<\/strong>&nbsp;and it is the amplification of extremes by weather system processes that cause the extreme events and consequential disasters we observe. For example, the Lismore (NSW) floods in 2022 were associated with multiple weather processes, initiated over the Southern Ocean and interacting with synoptic-scale processes and moist tropical air that led to a sequence of extreme weather events and catastrophic flooding. Global climate models cannot resolve these processes, an<strong>d therefore cannot tell us if such events will become more common in the future.<\/strong>&nbsp;As the weather that produces extreme events is&nbsp; connected globally, downscaling using high-resolution regional climate models<strong>&nbsp;cannot overcome the limitations introduced in the global models<\/strong>, as downscaling relies on the global models for information at its boundaries.-p17<\/p>\n\n\n\n<h4 class=\"wp-block-heading\">These transcripts come from Andy Pitmans speech in<a href=\"https:\/\/www.science.org.au\/news-and-events\/events\/launch-a-decadal-plan-for-australian-earth-system-science\">&nbsp;the launch webinar&nbsp;<\/a><\/h4>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">The speech and documents make tough reading. You get the feeling they just didn\u2019t want to tell us straight how bad the models are. I wanted to capture his exact words, for the record.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>All those environmental sinks might becomes sources (so much for carbon farming, eh?) Shame about that business you set up\u2026<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><em>7:30 [Andy Pitman] Some of these questions,&nbsp;<strong>you might think we have answers to\u2026.<\/strong><\/em><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><em>For example, many people would recognize both terrestrial and marine as providing a critical ecosystem service, it takes up human emissions of CO2, and provides enormous support for Australians Net Zero ambitions \u2026 but&nbsp;<strong>there\u2019s a little problem<\/strong>&nbsp;with this,&nbsp;<strong>we don\u2019t actually know to what degree our terrestrial and marine systems will continue to support our Net Zero ambitions<\/strong>&nbsp;and positive environmental outcomes. They may turn into sources of CO2 and methane, in ways that really undermine our Net Zero ambitions.<\/em><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>We will definitely get more water or less water, more river, or less river, more plants, or less..<\/strong>.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">9:00<em>&nbsp;In addition Australia is demonstrably at risk of abrupt changes in weather and climate. Many of you would be familiar with tipping points\u2026 It matters a great deal if we could say things about when and where these things might be realized. At the moment we really can\u2019t.<\/em><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">9:30<em>&nbsp; Water is obviously fundamental to the most arid inhabited continent on Earth. But we don\u2019t actually know whether Climate Change will increase or decrease flows of water through systems like the Murray Darling. We don\u2019t yet know whether changes in rainfall will be helped or hindered by the way ecosystems response under higher elevated CO2 concentration. Whether the higher water use efficiency of vegetation will help the flow of water through the Murray Darling or the vegetation will suppress the flow of water in the Murray Darling\u2026.<\/em><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">No we don\u2019t know what will happen to the cities:<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><em>Urban Areas, it\u2019 It might surprise a lot of you to know that the climate modeling systems we use internationally do not represent our urban landscapes.<\/em><\/p>\n\n\n\n<h4 class=\"wp-block-heading\">From the<a href=\"https:\/\/www.science.org.au\/supporting-science\/science-advice-and-policy\/decadal-plans-for-science\/a-decadal-plan-for-australian-earth-system-science-2024-2033\">&nbsp;PDF Launch<\/a>&nbsp;document<\/h4>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Page 13: Plants, rain, El nino, who knows?<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Some major challenges have been explored for decades \u2014 whether we will see a more El Nino or La Nina state in the future, or whether vegetation will help or hinder net zero ambition.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">These are not easily solvable\u2026<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Page 17 We can\u2019t predict extreme events, and they may not be getting worse, we don\u2019t know:<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">The Lismore (NSW) Floods in 2022 were associated with multiple weather process, initiated over the Southern Ocean and interacting with synoptic scale processes and moist tropical air that led to a sequence of<strong>&nbsp;extreme weather events<\/strong>&nbsp;and catastrophic flooding.&nbsp;<strong>Global climate models cannot resolve these processes and therefore cannot tell us if such events will become more common in the future.<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Further there is evidence the high-resolution coupled models simulate fundamentally different historical trends in tropical and Southern Ocean sea surface temperatures, reproducing recent observed changews which courses models cannot. They also exhibit greater low-frequency variability in midlatitude regions. Compare with Coupled Model Intercomparison Project (CMIP)-class models. Using current CMIP models, or indeed the regional models that rely on them, therefore r<strong>isks fundamentally wrong projections of future climate and its variability.<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Page 22: The current models are low resolution and can\u2019t do sea ice, clouds, storms, ice sheets, plants, cities and farms.<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Projections on timescales of decades to centuries at low spatial detail using Earth System models. The low spatial detail is balanced by large numbers of simulations. The lower computational cost means the more components can be included (e.g. Chemistry, fire, nutrients,) but some processes which may be extremely important are difficult to resolve (eh, sea ice, topographic forcing of clouds and storms, cloud processes, some ice sheet dynamics, vegetation demography, urban landscapes, agricultural areas).<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Page 25 contains Antarctic&nbsp;surprises like how 70 billion tonnes of snowfall accumulated across East Antarctica contributing to a net gain of mass in Antarctica \u2014 which was a reversal in the mass loss trend over the preceding 20 years..<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">A future with more ARs [atmospheric rivers] leading to a larger accumulation of snow on the Antarctic continent would be experienced very differently in Australia to a future with fewer ARS. Specifically projections o<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">The modelers didn\u2019t see that coming either.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<h4 class=\"wp-block-heading\">REFERENCES<\/h4>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><a href=\"https:\/\/www.science.org.au\/supporting-science\/science-advice-and-policy\/decadal-plans-for-science\/a-decadal-plan-for-australian-earth-system-science-2024-2033\">A&nbsp;Decadal Plan for Australian Earth System Science 2024\u20132033<\/a>, released November 25th, 2024<\/p>\n\n\n\n<h4 class=\"wp-block-heading\"><a href=\"https:\/\/www.science.org.au\/news-and-events\/events\/launch-a-decadal-plan-for-australian-earth-system-science\">The launch webinar&nbsp;<\/a><\/h4>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">\u2014 This one is for Julian. \u2014<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Turtle Model by&nbsp;<a href=\"https:\/\/pixabay.com\/users\/saif_sr4-14798291\/?utm_source=link-attribution&amp;utm_medium=referral&amp;utm_campaign=image&amp;utm_content=6225149\">SAIF 4<\/a>&nbsp;from&nbsp;<a href=\"https:\/\/pixabay.com\/\/?utm_source=link-attribution&amp;utm_medium=referral&amp;utm_campaign=image&amp;utm_content=6225149\">Pixabay<\/a><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Australia\u2019s leading climate modeler wants a big new Climate Agency, and to make the case he admits the current models really can\u2019t predict if rivers will rise or fall, if Antarctica will get bigger or smaller, if sea levels will rise much, or if El Ninos or La Nina will be more common or if the floods of Lismore will occur more often.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":121246920,"featured_media":356122,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"_coblocks_attr":"","_coblocks_dimensions":"","_coblocks_responsive_height":"","_coblocks_accordion_ie_support":"","advanced_seo_description":"","jetpack_seo_html_title":"","jetpack_seo_noindex":false,"_jetpack_newsletter_access":"","_jetpack_dont_email_post_to_subs":false,"_jetpack_newsletter_tier_id":0,"_jetpack_memberships_contains_paywalled_content":false,"_jetpack_feature_clip_id":0,"_jetpack_memberships_contains_paid_content":false,"footnotes":"","jetpack_publicize_message":"","jetpack_publicize_feature_enabled":true,"jetpack_social_post_already_shared":true,"jetpack_social_options":{"image_generator_settings":{"template":"highway","default_image_id":0,"font":"","enabled":false},"version":2},"jetpack_post_was_ever_published":false},"categories":[1],"tags":[691829997,691832181,691818056,691823598,691827527,691832182,691820106],"class_list":["post-356102","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-uncategorized","tag-carbon-dioxide-co","tag-climate-agency","tag-climate-change","tag-climate-modeler","tag-cmip-models","tag-ivory-tower-elitists","tag-tipping-points","fallback-thumbnail"],"jetpack_publicize_connections":[],"jetpack_featured_media_url":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/12\/0mike-newbry-DwtX9mMHBJ0-unsplash-scaled-1.jpg?fit=2560%2C1707&ssl=1","jetpack_likes_enabled":true,"jetpack_sharing_enabled":true,"jetpack_shortlink":"https:\/\/wp.me\/paxLW1-1uDA","jetpack-related-posts":[{"id":449614,"url":"https:\/\/climatescience.press\/?p=449614","url_meta":{"origin":356102,"position":0},"title":"No, Media, the Coming El Ni\u00f1o Isn\u2019t Creating a Looming Climate Catastrophe","author":"uwe.roland.gross","date":"06\/10\/2026","format":false,"excerpt":"Media outlets such as The Independent and Reuters are reporting in advance that a much anticipated strong El Ni\u00f1o will cause record high temperature and bad weather. Reuters claims the El Ni\u00f1o\u2019s effect will be so bad because it comes on top of and is exacerbated by human caused climate\u2026","rel":"","context":"In \"carbon dioxide (CO\u2082)\"","block_context":{"text":"carbon dioxide (CO\u2082)","link":"https:\/\/climatescience.press\/?tag=carbon-dioxide-co%e2%82%82"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2026\/06\/Super-El-Nino-Coming-Or-not.jpg?fit=1168%2C784&ssl=1&resize=350%2C200","width":350,"height":200,"srcset":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2026\/06\/Super-El-Nino-Coming-Or-not.jpg?fit=1168%2C784&ssl=1&resize=350%2C200 1x, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2026\/06\/Super-El-Nino-Coming-Or-not.jpg?fit=1168%2C784&ssl=1&resize=525%2C300 1.5x, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2026\/06\/Super-El-Nino-Coming-Or-not.jpg?fit=1168%2C784&ssl=1&resize=700%2C400 2x, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2026\/06\/Super-El-Nino-Coming-Or-not.jpg?fit=1168%2C784&ssl=1&resize=1050%2C600 3x"},"classes":[]},{"id":266764,"url":"https:\/\/climatescience.press\/?p=266764","url_meta":{"origin":356102,"position":1},"title":"Climate Models Come With \u2018Dangerous\u2019 CO2 Warming Baked In, Code Review Finds","author":"uwe.roland.gross","date":"07\/11\/2023","format":false,"excerpt":"The detailed examination has been written by the experienced computer programmer Willis Eschenbach and his paper\u00a0Climate Models and Climate Muddles\u00a0has been published by Net Zero Watch (NZW). Andrew Montford of NZW\u00a0discussed the paper\u00a0in a recent edition of the\u00a0Daily Sceptic, noting that climate models are at the centre of the global\u2026","rel":"","context":"In \"climate alarmism\"","block_context":{"text":"climate alarmism","link":"https:\/\/climatescience.press\/?tag=climate-alarmism"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2023\/07\/image-314.png?fit=1024%2C1024&ssl=1&resize=350%2C200","width":350,"height":200,"srcset":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2023\/07\/image-314.png?fit=1024%2C1024&ssl=1&resize=350%2C200 1x, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2023\/07\/image-314.png?fit=1024%2C1024&ssl=1&resize=525%2C300 1.5x, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2023\/07\/image-314.png?fit=1024%2C1024&ssl=1&resize=700%2C400 2x"},"classes":[]},{"id":238258,"url":"https:\/\/climatescience.press\/?p=238258","url_meta":{"origin":356102,"position":2},"title":"Expert discusses La Ni\u00f1a and El Ni\u00f1o cycles effects on Australia","author":"uwe.roland.gross","date":"01\/07\/2023","format":false,"excerpt":"The\u00a0last El Ni\u00f1o\u00a0was 6-7 years ago, but elapsed time can\u2019t on its own be a guarantee of one this year. Neutral ENSO conditions are another option. As usual an assertion about warming from greenhouse gases is thrown in, with no evidence to back it up.","rel":"","context":"Similar post","block_context":{"text":"Similar post","link":""},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2023\/01\/image-243.png?fit=1200%2C675&ssl=1&resize=350%2C200","width":350,"height":200,"srcset":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2023\/01\/image-243.png?fit=1200%2C675&ssl=1&resize=350%2C200 1x, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2023\/01\/image-243.png?fit=1200%2C675&ssl=1&resize=525%2C300 1.5x, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2023\/01\/image-243.png?fit=1200%2C675&ssl=1&resize=700%2C400 2x, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2023\/01\/image-243.png?fit=1200%2C675&ssl=1&resize=1050%2C600 3x"},"classes":[]},{"id":448428,"url":"https:\/\/climatescience.press\/?p=448428","url_meta":{"origin":356102,"position":3},"title":"Wrong, Associated Press, Computer Simulations Don\u2019t Mean Smashed Heat Records Will Occur","author":"uwe.roland.gross","date":"06\/04\/2026","format":false,"excerpt":"The Associated Press (AP) claims in \u201cThink it\u2019s hot now? The next five years will smash records, UN says\u201d that Earth is \u201coverwhelmingly likely\u201d to repeatedly surge past the 1.5\u00b0C threshold and experience escalating heatwaves and extreme weather from 2026 to 2030. This is highly misleading if not outright false.\u2026","rel":"","context":"In \"Climate change\"","block_context":{"text":"Climate change","link":"https:\/\/climatescience.press\/?tag=climate-change"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2026\/06\/0-Copilot_Wrong-Associated-Press-Computer-Simulations-Dont-Mean-Smashed-Heat-Records-Will-Occur.png?fit=1024%2C1024&ssl=1&resize=350%2C200","width":350,"height":200,"srcset":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2026\/06\/0-Copilot_Wrong-Associated-Press-Computer-Simulations-Dont-Mean-Smashed-Heat-Records-Will-Occur.png?fit=1024%2C1024&ssl=1&resize=350%2C200 1x, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2026\/06\/0-Copilot_Wrong-Associated-Press-Computer-Simulations-Dont-Mean-Smashed-Heat-Records-Will-Occur.png?fit=1024%2C1024&ssl=1&resize=525%2C300 1.5x, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2026\/06\/0-Copilot_Wrong-Associated-Press-Computer-Simulations-Dont-Mean-Smashed-Heat-Records-Will-Occur.png?fit=1024%2C1024&ssl=1&resize=700%2C400 2x"},"classes":[]},{"id":273862,"url":"https:\/\/climatescience.press\/?p=273862","url_meta":{"origin":356102,"position":4},"title":"Climate Modelling in Australia","author":"uwe.roland.gross","date":"08\/16\/2023","format":false,"excerpt":"Australia\u2019s mostly government funded scientific research organisation, CSIRO, has participated in the United Nations IPCC program to identify human impacts on climate.\u00a0 CSIRO has contributed to the various assessment reports through evolving climate models over the past 20 years.","rel":"","context":"In \"ACCESS model\"","block_context":{"text":"ACCESS model","link":"https:\/\/climatescience.press\/?tag=access-model"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2023\/08\/020140125-ozclim-GFDL-CM2-1-Aus-moderate-rainfall-2095.png?fit=1200%2C895&ssl=1&resize=350%2C200","width":350,"height":200,"srcset":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2023\/08\/020140125-ozclim-GFDL-CM2-1-Aus-moderate-rainfall-2095.png?fit=1200%2C895&ssl=1&resize=350%2C200 1x, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2023\/08\/020140125-ozclim-GFDL-CM2-1-Aus-moderate-rainfall-2095.png?fit=1200%2C895&ssl=1&resize=525%2C300 1.5x, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2023\/08\/020140125-ozclim-GFDL-CM2-1-Aus-moderate-rainfall-2095.png?fit=1200%2C895&ssl=1&resize=700%2C400 2x, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2023\/08\/020140125-ozclim-GFDL-CM2-1-Aus-moderate-rainfall-2095.png?fit=1200%2C895&ssl=1&resize=1050%2C600 3x"},"classes":[]},{"id":276095,"url":"https:\/\/climatescience.press\/?p=276095","url_meta":{"origin":356102,"position":5},"title":"Walker Circulation study is a damp squib for climate worriers, contradicts\u00a0models","author":"uwe.roland.gross","date":"08\/28\/2023","format":false,"excerpt":"The paper this article is based on informs us that \u2018The Pacific Walker circulation (PWC) has an outsized influence on weather and climate worldwide. Yet the PWC response to external forcings is unclear\u2019.","rel":"","context":"In \"Climate change\"","block_context":{"text":"Climate change","link":"https:\/\/climatescience.press\/?tag=climate-change"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2023\/08\/0enso.jpg?fit=1200%2C800&ssl=1&resize=350%2C200","width":350,"height":200,"srcset":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2023\/08\/0enso.jpg?fit=1200%2C800&ssl=1&resize=350%2C200 1x, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2023\/08\/0enso.jpg?fit=1200%2C800&ssl=1&resize=525%2C300 1.5x, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2023\/08\/0enso.jpg?fit=1200%2C800&ssl=1&resize=700%2C400 2x, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/climatescience.press\/wp-content\/uploads\/2023\/08\/0enso.jpg?fit=1200%2C800&ssl=1&resize=1050%2C600 3x"},"classes":[]}],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/climatescience.press\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/posts\/356102","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/climatescience.press\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/climatescience.press\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/climatescience.press\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/users\/121246920"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/climatescience.press\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Fcomments&post=356102"}],"version-history":[{"count":5,"href":"https:\/\/climatescience.press\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/posts\/356102\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":356124,"href":"https:\/\/climatescience.press\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/posts\/356102\/revisions\/356124"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/climatescience.press\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/media\/356122"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/climatescience.press\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Fmedia&parent=356102"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/climatescience.press\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Fcategories&post=356102"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/climatescience.press\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Ftags&post=356102"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}